Respectfully disagree. Stretching to address particular deficits has limited benefits and duration in my opinion. If anything, I find WHOLE BODY STRETCHING such as that recommended by Adrian Crook's INFLEX program stretches not only the fascia but achieves overall limberness and ease of movement in ways beyond the sum of the stretches. You feel 'well-oiled' beyond a few Maxwell mobility drills or DeFranco 'saigon squats', etc. If you make it a daily habit I believe you'll find cumulative benefits that can't be understood just by 'performing a stretch' per se.
Loss of hip mobility is a pervasive and major problem among older people who sit in chairs and don't regularly squat to defecate or sit cross-legged on the floor. Tightness in these muscles tends to cause a cascading effect, as the body first tightens one muscles, then another, and then more of the first, with the final result being the typical nursing home patient, who can no longer move the hip normally but rather shuffles along and is in constant pain from tight muscles cutting off the blood flow. This is why stretching IS important, contrary to your post at the top of the page.
The muscles that tighten are the medial hip rotators (anterior head of the gluteus medius and the tensor fasciae latae or TFL in the video). The video shows a good sequence for loosening those muscles. Effectively, these are variations on the yoga pigeon pose. Simply cross-legged in any of the yoga sitting poses (other than the so-called easy pose, which is too easy) for 10 minutes a day should also do the trick. The hip muscles are very strong and the body naturally wants these muscles moderately tight so as to protect from dislocations, so it can take a long time to loosen this joint if the muscles get too tight.
The shoulder and neck muscles are two other areas that tend to tighten up and weaken in old people. The shoulder is easy to stretch because the muscles aren't that big, the leverage is very good, and if you screw up and hurt the shoulder, the consequences aren't that serious. But the neck is trickier, which is why yoga spends so much time on the neck (shoulderstand, plough, fish, headstand). If the neck muscles ever get weak and tight, you're in for a world of pain.
I'm just looking for consistency in people's blog posts that I follow.
You can't really write constantly about stretching being BS and then show a guy with his legs over his head as a suggested resource.
There are people who stretch and contort their body in amazing ways but this is not something one would ever observe in nature.
To advocate any unnatural sustained movements seems ignorant.
do we really need a bunch of studies or blogging "experts" advocating absurd poses just to create a reason for another video
get into that pose while you're crawling through bushes as a more movenat style pose but don't sit there for 5 minutes "stretching" and say this is going to add so much value to an elderly person
what 80 year old could even get close to that pose if they were not already in abnormally good shape
if an average 80 year old did that pose they'd be asking for an injury
As Michael Winner might say.... "calm down dear" I am not claiming to be an expert.
The consistency you get here is that I consistently put up and share whatever I find that I think is interesting and to which I might want to return in future. My general view of stretching is with the Sock Doc, Maffetone and others who point out that the research is that it doesn't offer benefits and can be harmful. I am also very sympathetic to the Feldenkrais approach of Somatics and Todd Hargrove and think the role of the brain and nervous system in general is under appreciated. However I am interested in how Kelly S gets his results in practice with his athletes.
If you don't like this blog or find it inconsistent, no one is forcing you to read it.
John here once again, I think Kelly Starret (kStar) gets his results from people because he is a Doctor of Physical Therapy. And he advocates stretching and mobilizing to attain a good bio-mechanical position. Lets keep it that simple. Not saying who's right and who's wrong.
Just saying he, a world class supple-ass doctor, recommends that you stretch AFTER workouts, with gusto, and possibly before if you cannot attain correct positioning. Unless we find substantial evidence to the contrary, I would go with the world-class olympian training therapist over there. My two cents.
-John
P.S. They have flexibility requirements set up specifically to different sports that maximize performance. Olympic lifters need a certain level of hip flexibility while baseball pitchers need a different level of shoulder flexibility. I hate to sound so arrogant but the scientific/training community kind of already figured this stuff out =P.
I think its important to consider the athlete/person and their individual goals. Certain sports and their movements may require one to increase flexibility, and that process can be guided through strength training and various stretches. Which exercises and which stretches depends upon the athlete and their training session that day. A dancer or gymnast should probably do static stretching before their workout but after a general warm up and dynamic stretches because they will do static stretching holds in practice and competition. A kickboxer, however, only needs a basic warm up and dynamic arm and leg swings to prepare for punching and kicks. So my idea is that those who require more than average flexibility should use specific stretches to get there. Static and isometric stretches should be done post work out. For the average person how doesn't require amazing flexibility, they will get more bang for their buck by addressing general health issues on their own and nervous system issues by a trained professional. My two cents.
10 comments:
That's an incredible stretch. The fact that you can not only do it, but do it whilst wearing jeans is remarkable.
So are we stretching or not stretching?
Can you make a distinction on what you're advocating. Looks like a stretch but your previous post (and many others) say no stretching
?
As far as I see it.....
stretch to address particular deficits, problems and postural issues. Don't stretch to warm up or prevent DOMS or expect to limit injury.
By the way, some of the stuff on here is just material that I find interesting and am thinking through
Respectfully disagree. Stretching to address particular deficits has limited benefits and duration in my opinion. If anything, I find WHOLE BODY STRETCHING such as that recommended by Adrian Crook's INFLEX program stretches not only the fascia but achieves overall limberness and ease of movement in ways beyond the sum of the stretches. You feel 'well-oiled' beyond a few Maxwell mobility drills or DeFranco 'saigon squats', etc. If you make it a daily habit I believe you'll find cumulative benefits that can't be understood just by 'performing a stretch' per se.
Loss of hip mobility is a pervasive and major problem among older people who sit in chairs and don't regularly squat to defecate or sit cross-legged on the floor. Tightness in these muscles tends to cause a cascading effect, as the body first tightens one muscles, then another, and then more of the first, with the final result being the typical nursing home patient, who can no longer move the hip normally but rather shuffles along and is in constant pain from tight muscles cutting off the blood flow. This is why stretching IS important, contrary to your post at the top of the page.
The muscles that tighten are the medial hip rotators (anterior head of the gluteus medius and the tensor fasciae latae or TFL in the video). The video shows a good sequence for loosening those muscles. Effectively, these are variations on the yoga pigeon pose. Simply cross-legged in any of the yoga sitting poses (other than the so-called easy pose, which is too easy) for 10 minutes a day should also do the trick. The hip muscles are very strong and the body naturally wants these muscles moderately tight so as to protect from dislocations, so it can take a long time to loosen this joint if the muscles get too tight.
The shoulder and neck muscles are two other areas that tend to tighten up and weaken in old people. The shoulder is easy to stretch because the muscles aren't that big, the leverage is very good, and if you screw up and hurt the shoulder, the consequences aren't that serious. But the neck is trickier, which is why yoga spends so much time on the neck (shoulderstand, plough, fish, headstand). If the neck muscles ever get weak and tight, you're in for a world of pain.
I'm just looking for consistency in people's blog posts that I follow.
You can't really write constantly about stretching being BS and then show a guy with his legs over his head as a suggested resource.
There are people who stretch and contort their body in amazing ways but this is not something one would ever observe in nature.
To advocate any unnatural sustained movements seems ignorant.
do we really need a bunch of studies or blogging "experts" advocating absurd poses just to create a reason for another video
get into that pose while you're crawling through bushes as a more movenat style pose but don't sit there for 5 minutes "stretching" and say this is going to add so much value to an elderly person
what 80 year old could even get close to that pose if they were not already in abnormally good shape
if an average 80 year old did that pose they'd be asking for an injury
consistency = loyal readers
Who mentioned 80 year olds?
As Michael Winner might say.... "calm down dear" I am not claiming to be an expert.
The consistency you get here is that I consistently put up and share whatever I find that I think is interesting and to which I might want to return in future. My general view of stretching is with the Sock Doc, Maffetone and others who point out that the research is that it doesn't offer benefits and can be harmful. I am also very sympathetic to the Feldenkrais approach of Somatics and Todd Hargrove and think the role of the brain and nervous system in general is under appreciated. However I am interested in how Kelly S gets his results in practice with his athletes.
If you don't like this blog or find it inconsistent, no one is forcing you to read it.
John here once again,
I think Kelly Starret (kStar) gets his results from people because he is a Doctor of Physical Therapy. And he advocates stretching and mobilizing to attain a good bio-mechanical position. Lets keep it that simple. Not saying who's right and who's wrong.
Just saying he, a world class supple-ass doctor, recommends that you stretch AFTER workouts, with gusto, and possibly before if you cannot attain correct positioning. Unless we find substantial evidence to the contrary, I would go with the world-class olympian training therapist over there. My two cents.
-John
P.S. They have flexibility requirements set up specifically to different sports that maximize performance. Olympic lifters need a certain level of hip flexibility while baseball pitchers need a different level of shoulder flexibility. I hate to sound so arrogant but the scientific/training community kind of already figured this stuff out =P.
Thanks John. That is helpful.
I think its important to consider the athlete/person and their individual goals. Certain sports and their movements may require one to increase flexibility, and that process can be guided through strength training and various stretches. Which exercises and which stretches depends upon the athlete and their training session that day. A dancer or gymnast should probably do static stretching before their workout but after a general warm up and dynamic stretches because they will do static stretching holds in practice and competition. A kickboxer, however, only needs a basic warm up and dynamic arm and leg swings to prepare for punching and kicks. So my idea is that those who require more than average flexibility should use specific stretches to get there. Static and isometric stretches should be done post work out. For the average person how doesn't require amazing flexibility, they will get more bang for their buck by addressing general health issues on their own and nervous system issues by a trained professional. My two cents.
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